Where in the Bible is the Greek word adelphos used to describe siblings having the same mother but different fathers. Some of these questions are for both of you but it might be better if I ask a question, just one of you respond since we have so many. I agree with what that person teaches. Christie eventually got cut on October 4. However, he should have cited what Jimmy said immediately before that quote: It wasnt entirely clear to every group of Jews exactly what books belonged in the Old Testament., Akin goes on to write that Jesus and the apostles went a bit further than the Pharisees on the issue of the canon. No, I dont think you are following my point. Thank you very much, Steve. Should it be included in the Old Testament canon? So summarize, the Bible does not teach that Mary sin nor does it teach that every single human being has committed a sin or inherited original sin without exception. Im not sure why she would be surprised when told that shes going to have a son, given that under Jewish law, she and Joseph were free to engage in conjugal relations even right at that moment after the angel had left. Anyone who denies this dogma automatically contradicts scripture because if Jesus is God and Mary is the mother of Jesus. Id have to respond individually. Okay. Advertisement "God gave us the greatest apologist of this. Now in the Septuagint as well as in the New Testament, adelphos is used to talk about people who have the same father but different mothers. steve.christie@phmloans.com. Thank you very much, Trent. My goal today is to show that the Marian dogmas do not contradict Scripture. And I think we both agree on the assumption, Steve said it the Bible does not say Mary was not assumed into heaven, and in order to try to show her assumption would contradict it, we had to use a very speculative argument about that she did not need to be rescued from death, even though that doesnt apply to every case where God would take someone into heaven. If Mary kept the law, she could not be made righteous since righteousness does not come from keeping the law, but through Christs death. Though a mere chip-shot, from 32 yards, the three-pointer enabled . Hes referred to the son of Joseph in Johns gospel. I mean, focusing on it saying that they had the same mothers is a little bit of a strawman because thats an argument that youre using which I feel is really irrelevant because you could use the argument that Jesus had younger half sisters because theres nothing in that passage to eliminate that possibility. Apologetics for the Masses #366 - 4 Words That Changed the World, Part III. I was citing Baukham on that point, and [Greek 00:52:31] is just not used in the New Testament, so its just not a common word. Paul himself reaffirms this in Romans 9:11. So hes just talking about this birthright that he mentions about 10 versus later. So when does Marion devotion turn into idolatry? So does the Bible say Mary gave birth to anyone besides Jesus? And Trent and I would agree that doesnt mean it, in fact, that wasnt even an argument. Okay. If she were sinless, what would happen to her if she-. So here, Mary can be talking about salvation from threats in this life, not sin. But anyways, Im going to come back to that. Yeah. In order to justify that claim, Christie would have to present a standard that tells us what writings prior to Christ are inspired and why we should accept that particular standard. Man commits idolatry when he honors and reviews a creature in place of God. But even St. Louis de Montfort who uses very lofty language of Mary says of her that she is but one Adam in comparison to the infinite and majestic glory that is God. And we can actually discern from others passages in scripture that Jesus brothers are his biological younger half siblings. Heres a question that I have that Id be interested in both of you answering. Instead, we should listen to Christ, his apostles, and the Church they founded for the answer to what constitutes Sacred Scripture. So to talk about things that came up in this debate, there are things that came up that were not debating, things like Sola Scriptura, the history of the Marian dogmas. Acts 23 describes Paul citing his pharisaical heritage as a defensive legal maneuver, which Christie believes is significant because Paul tells the other Jews present that he is a Pharisee. Though, I think that is a salvation issue actually. And of course, he might say, Well, what about Jesus? Well, as I mentioned, the Bibles explicit that it says that Jesus is an exception. The purpose of this debate, as Trent had brought up, is about the Marian Dogmas. And hes not. H. Well, not necessarily. And so I would say if youre a Protestant, for Protestants and Catholics, if the Marian dogmas can occupy at least that place. But when you look into church history, its kind of hard to answer that question because even Trent cannot say about somebody that agreed exactly the way that he does. Good, because you know what? Well, the kinsfolk, you can have relatives that dont know very much about you or misunderstand you. And weve seen that time and time again, and so Im going to address the other examples that hes just raised. And Catholics are very clear, we do not believe anything that contradicts what we find in sacred Scripture. Does the Bible teach that no human being has ever been assumed into heaven? These would be children from his previous marriage, making them adoptive brothers and sisters, and as such, they would be fully Jesuss brother and sister, the full use of the word adelphos. Im just asking is there an example of anywhere in scripture where its used to describe siblings they have the same mother but they have different fathers? Can you repeat the question real quick? So, if the greatest of those born before Christ wasnt constricted to accepting the canon Christie is defending, then we shouldnt be compelled to do the same, either. Geoffrey Stephen "Steve" Christie (born November 13, 1967) is a former Canadian American football placekicker in the National Football League, who, as a member Steve Christie - Top podcast episodes The question for Joseph-. The NAB, a Catholic translation authorized by the Confraternity of Christian Doctrine and approved by the National Conference of Catholic Bishops and the United States Catholic Conference supports this. The YouTube show, which was created by Kyle Curtis and Steve McRae, often featured interesting guests, such as Hugh Ross, Inspiring Philosophy, Shannon Q, Sy Garte, Matt Dillahunty, Paulogia, Lawrence Krauss, and more. It can only mean figurative sister or biological sister. September 16, 2018 by Randal. Steve Christie Geoffrey Stephen Christie Position: K 6-0 , 195lb (183cm, 88kg) Born: November 13 in Oakville, Ontario (Age: 55-107d) College: William & Mary Weighted Career AV (100-95-. Indeed, the Talmudic tract Sanhedrin 100B refers to rabbis with-drawing Sirach, or declaring it to be no longer inspired and thus withdrawn from synagogue reading. How would you treat that thing? So whenever you want to begin, I will click the 10 minute button. Im just saying that shows that Joseph had other children who were from other women, just like when we see in the beginning of Matthews gospel, talking about adelphos is used of Jacobs siblings, the children of Jacob, who were born from different women, Leah and Rachel. (Horn V. Christie). . I didnt talk about sister-in-law. Well start with you, Steve. Number two is when Steve said, well, I dont think the church died off. For example, Jesus said among those born of women none was greater than John the Baptist (Luke 7:28)and John was not a Pharisee. I command that you do it. What he lived by, he died by. Heres one, Trent, I dont like and I wonder what you think about it. Geoffrey Stephen "Steve" Christie (born November 13, 1967) is a former Canadian American football placekicker in the National Football League, who, as a member Steve Christie - Nangungunang mga yugto ng podcast So then it isnt literally saying every single human has sinned or every man has sinned. And even if it wasnt, I dont see the relevance to it. In the 2000 season, Christie was an instrumental part of the Bills' eight victories. I have also appeared several He had mentioned about, in the book of Jude, about Moses and the devil contending for the body, or Michael contending with a body of Moses with Michael the archangel. And I showed counter examples to that in each of those cases. A concrete example of this would be sacrifice. Alright what about the Immaculate Conception? A four-month investigation found the late Ravi Zacharias leveraged his reputation as a world-famous Christian apologist to abuse massage therapists in the United States and abroad over more than. Check out this great listen on Audible.com. I believe all things are possible with God. So this question is for Steve and this comes from Kevin, whos a local supporter. And, as it turns out, Christies book fails to produce any such standard. On the signing, Christie pointed out that one reason for joining the team was "basically doing Michael (Clemons) a favour" as a former college teammate and that it was tentatively for one game. on So they probably were aware of something very special about her at that time. Steve, we just heard from David Wright, the clock is ticking, those batteries could run out by early next week. Lets talk about the perpetual virginity of Mary. Thread info Bookmark this thread Trash this thread. Did the reformers believe every Catholic truth? Heres my thought on that. Thank you very much, Trent. 23:2), some of whom were not Pharisees. Mary also did not need to be bodily assumed to heaven like Enoch and Elijah, so they would not see death, supported by the earliest church tradition, indirectly supported by Scripture, and strongly implied by the dogma itself. There is no exception there. First Corinthians 15, in my opening statement, it says that there are heavenly bodies and earthly bodies and people who have earthly bodies are sown perishable, meaning corruptible in dishonor, meaning contempt, reproach. Tweet: 0 replies, 655 views. No, thats fine. But renowned Protestant Greek grammarian Bill Mounce says Jesus reference to Nicodemus as the teacher of Israel is actually a sarcastic rebuke. Were going to be taking those questions. Wait until after the debate, but if you want to go there now, its about that. I run morning podcasts here on locals. And you, just so people are aware, arent being mean or anything by doing that. And the other concern, again, that I have is from Lumen Gentium, which is a Dogmatic Constitution of the Church, that it is binding to Catholics that even if a Roman pontiff does not speak ex cathedra, it is binding. Now someone pointed out in the chat that only, what is it, 65% of people have submitted to my legality. It has to be interpreted charitably, or its possible there might be an error in a magisterial statement recounting history, but that doesnt apply the charism to the doctrine itself. Thats right. Yeah. His primary concern is to simply say that Jesus had no earthly father. This is something Paul gave as concession, not as command to others. Mean figurative sister or biological sister command to others think you are following my.! Purpose of this debate, but if you want to begin, I will click 10... Mary can be talking about this birthright that he mentions about 10 versus later the son of Joseph Johns... Course, he might say, well, as it turns out, Christies book fails to produce any standard. Just raised produce any such standard if Jesus is an exception gave as concession, not.... And I showed counter examples to that in each of those cases has ever been assumed heaven. Pointed out in the Old Testament canon the World, Part III God and Mary is the word! 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